the blog for echos
"Is Sponge Bob gay?" That is the story that came on CNN as I ate my lunch today. The first thought that came into my head is "You've got to be kidding me." An evangelical Christian group called Focus on the Family was offended by the sexual content found within the kids show Sponge Bob Square pants. The TV showed militant fifth graders taking to the streets to protest this action and show their support for their beloved cartoon character by wearing sponge bob pajamas and sponge bob t-shirts. Now you'd think with all the disasters, wars, and general suffering going on in the world today people would find better things to argue over, but here we are arguing over the sexual preferences over a character who in real life is actually a hermaphrodite containing both male and female traits.
This reminds me of Russia in 1917 right before the Communist Revolution. The Russian Orthodox Church met in their national assembly to discuss the raging debates and the pressing issues of their time. Now you'd think they would discuss the growing threat of nihilistic philosophy creeping into their academic communitiy, the unrest of the poor, the growing threat of their neighbor Germany, but instead the raging debate was the proper color for the sacramental robes.
I understand that to these Christians, Sponge Bob represents the spiritual decadence of American culture, that we are a people who have grown calloused to the evil "manifesting itself in the gay community" and are naively exposing our children to the harmless evils that is slowly corrupting them. I can understand their concern and their fear. But the American Church is quickly becoming absolutely right and utterly irrelevant.
Christianity has so much to offer and to be reduced to this, quibbling over the sexual preferences of a cartoon character, saddens me greatly. Where are the thinkers of the Church who can wrestle with the questions of this age and offer wisdom and hope in these dark times? Where are the Augustines or the Chestertons of this age? It is little use to me, if a Christian can tell me whether Sponge Bob is gay or not. I honestly don't care. I'd rather have someone explain to me why I can't find it in myself to love anyone regardless of gender, or how these same Christians can honestly justify spending thousands of dollars on superflous items while their so-called brothers and sisters in third world countries starve to death. But instead they'd rather pick on Sponge Bob. Sponge Bob has become the sacremental robes of our times. If this is the caliber of contemplation that the Church's leading minds wrestle with, then our end is approaching faster than we imagine.
After 9/11 church attendance surged as people poured in looking for answers, hope, something to explain the destruction they had witnessed. But after a few monthes church attendance returned back to normal. Why is this? I think it's because people went to church and then left the church because they found the church had nothing to offer them. That is what it means to be absolutely right and utterly irrelevant."

Comments
on Feb 03, 2005
Heh, another Is Sponge Bob gay aritcle. You can never get enough of these can you? I personally think that Sponge Bob is not something for little kids. I saw one episode that shows Sponge Bob taking some fish and putting a cheese grater to his butt and then rubbing it on his butt. I think that's kinda gay. But maybe you don't.

~carebear~
on Feb 03, 2005
"An evangelical Christian group called Focus on the Family was offended by the sexual content found within the kids show Sponge Bob Square pants."

Wrong. The whole "Spongebob is gay" thing started in the homosexual community, mostly online, and has nothing to do with what you are talking about. Nothing in your article has anything to do with what really happened. I guess you were paying more attention to your lunch than CNN.

When you write blogs you should take the time to look into the story you are writing about. Obviously you didn't visit Focus on the Family's site or read about the situation. The Focus on the Family situation didn't even have anything to do with Spongebob's cartoon. Rather, a video being mailed out to 61,000 schools from an organization called "The We Are Family Foundation".

I have an article about this: SpongeBob's Sexuality isn't in Question (But should he be used as propaganda?). There are about 20 more here as well. Sorry that you wasted that rant on a non-issue, but the people you are talking about aren't saying Spongebob is gay, and never have.

Maybe with a little research you could make a rant about the people who are really branding Spongebob "gay friendly". You wouldn't get to bash Christians much though, huh?

on Feb 03, 2005
Wrong. The whole "Spongebob is gay" thing started in the homosexual community, mostly online, and has nothing to do with what you are talking about. Nothing in your article has anything to do with what really happened. I guess you were paying more attention to your lunch than CNN.


Wrong. If you'll actually read what he was saying in his article, you'll see that he barely mentioned the specifics of what is actually being brought up with this whole "gay Spongebob video" thing. It wasn't really an article debating the current issue of the video being given to schools, he was drawing a parallel between what these groups see as important, and what others throughout history has seen as important.

Then he talked about the rise in church attendance after 9/11 and how it only lasted for a little while because
I think it's because people went to church and then left the church because they found the church had nothing to offer them.


You wouldn't get to bash Christians much though, huh?


He also didn't actually do any Christian bashing at all. I read that he just believe some Christian groups might have their priorities a little messed up.

Before you waste your time bashing someone else's articles, mayhap you should actually read their articles and try to understand what point they're trying to make before you rubber-stamp their entire article as "wrong" just because it mentions the whole "SpongBob is gay" thing.
on Feb 03, 2005

Splateaux:

"Wrong. If you'll actually read what he was saying in his article, you'll see that he barely mentioned the specifics of what is actually being brought up with this whole "gay Spongebob video" thing."

It is quite clear what the rant is based upon, since he reiterates it over and over and over. Before you waste your time bashing my criticism, maybe you should read the article yourself.

'An evangelical Christian group called Focus on the Family was offended by the sexual content found within the kids show Sponge Bob Square pants."

' I understand that to these Christians, Sponge Bob represents the spiritual decadence of American culture"

"But instead they'd rather pick on Sponge Bob (...) If this is the caliber of contemplation that the Church's leading minds wrestle with, then our end is approaching faster than we imagine."

That isn't what the "Church's mind" is wrestling with, so.. how is the point valid? The idea that ...

"...he was drawing a parallel between what these groups see as important, and what others throughout history has seen as important."

...is silly since the author doesn't seem to know what Christians see as important in this issue. He claims that spongebob's sexuality or morality is what Christians are taking exception to. It isn't, and hasn't been. Thus, anything he builds on the supposition is false.

If i write an article about how you should spend more time worrying about peace and charity instead of alien conspiracies to take over the world, i should at least be fairly sure that you concern yourself about alien conspiracies to take over the world. if not, my point is pretty much self-defeating..

"An evangelical Christian group called Focus on the Family was offended by the sexual content found within the kids show Sponge Bob Square pants."

I would challenge the author to back up the statement, or remove it. It is my understanding that it is patently false. There's nothing of the kind on CNN online, and I doubt seriously that anything of the kind was on the tv network.

If you want to protest inthe religion section about Christians not having their priorities right, or wrongfully condemning a cartoon character, maybe you should back up the statement before you draw a bunch of conclusions from it. To my knowledge Focus on the Family have made no such statement.

on Feb 04, 2005
Wrong. The whole "Spongebob is gay" thing started in the homosexual community, mostly online, and has nothing to do with what you are talking about. Nothing in your article has anything to do with what really happened. I guess you were paying more attention to your lunch than CNN. When you write blogs you should take the time to look into the story you are writing about. Obviously you didn't visit Focus on the Family's site or read about the situation. The Focus on the Family situation didn't even have anything to do with Spongebob's cartoon. Rather, a video being mailed out to 61,000 schools from an organization called "The We Are Family Foundation".


Well, thank you for that criticism. It is quite valid actually. I was more interested in my lunch than the twenty second CNN story I saw on TV. And no I didn't do any research or visit the Focus on the Family website. And I did not take the time to study the subtlties and nuances of the Christian position on this issue. I was sloppy and got flamed for it. All very valid.
How long have you been blogging? This is my very first blog. I was not aware that a blog should be a research paper. I thought a blog was a place to voice opinions and observations. I formulated thoughts based on a twenty second headline story I saw on CNN yesterday. Is this irresponsible and myopic? Yes it is and I apologize, but my underlying message is not against Sponge Bob.

...is silly since the author doesn't seem to know what Christians see as important in this issue. He claims that spongebob's sexuality or morality is what Christians are taking exception to. It isn't, and hasn't been. Thus, anything he builds on the supposition is false.


What is the important issue then?

Maybe with a little research you could make a rant about the people who are really branding Spongebob "gay friendly". You wouldn't get to bash Christians much though, huh?


I am a Christian myself. I get nervous when Christians replace the gospel with an agenda, even the right agendas. It's that whole priority mix up thing Splateaux mentioned.

I would challenge the author to back up the statement, or remove it. It is my understanding that it is patently false. There's nothing of the kind on CNN online, and I doubt seriously that anything of the kind was on the tv network.


You feel passionately about this issue. I do not. The links below are referring to that video you mentioned, not the Sponge Bob show itself. I can concede that you are right in your research and I was wrong. However, what have you proved? That you are able to outmanuever an unprepared opponent on an issue that he did not care about. You have won but so what? I believe that you have replaced the gospel with a message that is political in nature. You see enemies all around you and observations become a rant, and criticism becomes a bashing. When I ask my 'non-christian' friends what comes to mind when I ask them what a Christian is they respond with a political agenda, whether that is abortion, gay rights, censorship. Very few say they see Jesus in Christians. And this is sad because I became a Christian through people who showed me Jesus Christ by taking me in and caring for me. I will never bash that Church. But like the Pharisees before you, you are replacing the gospel with a message that cannot save, only divide. There is no grace in your words, only meaness and a desire to be right.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4190699.stm

"We see the video as an insidious means by which the organisation is manipulating and potentially brainwashing kids," Paul Batura, a spokesman for Focus on the Family, told the New York Times.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/TV/01/20/sponge.bob.reut/index.html

"Their inclusion of the reference to 'sexual identity" within their 'tolerance pledge' is not only unnecessary, but it crosses a moral line," James Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family, said in a statement released Thursday.

on Feb 04, 2005
*boggle*

You falsely accuse an entire religion of being overly concerned with a cartoon character's sexuality, and it's MY message that "cannot save, only divide?" I think that's worthy of a "Are you on Crack?" look.

If you take issue with how they feel about the We Are Family Foundation video, then I strongly urge you to rewrite the blog, express yourself. I don't have a problem with you disagreeing with Christianity or organized religion. What I do take offense to, is when people in the media, comedians, bloggers, paint Christians as people who are infatuated with the sexuality of a cartoon character.

Had you taken exception with true feelings of Christians, you wouldn't have heard a peep out of me, or maybe we'd have had a decent conversation. Instead you just made a lot of untrue assumptions and then based your rant on them. The fact that even now, after you know it is wrong, you are leaving heaps of falsehoods in your article troubles me, and makes me wonder if you are sincere in your care about Christianity.

"An evangelical Christian group called Focus on the Family was offended by the sexual content found within the kids show Sponge Bob Square pants."

That's simply untrue. It perpetuates the same smear that has been tossed around on Saturday Night Live and silly pundit shows that don't do their homework. I appreciate your feelings, but further spreading mischaracterizations isn't doing anyone any good, and CAN ONLY DIVIDE, lol...

on Feb 04, 2005
You falsely accuse an entire religion of being overly concerned with a cartoon character's sexuality,

Had you taken exception with true feelings of Christians


It's okay for you to bash someone who generalized "Christians" based upon what they read, see, etc... but then you turn right around and assume that YOU know the "true feelings" of all Christians?

There is no grace in your words, only meaness and a desire to be right.


EchoDecember said that this is his first blogging experience, but he's already observant enough to see what has become apparent to me whenever I read your comments. You never appear interested in hearing what anyone else says, but mostly only interested in tearing them down and trying to be the winner of the argument.

It seems that you've convinced yourself that you're right about everything you believe. I can feel nothing but pity for you at this point, because that means you've closed your mind, and are no longer learning

Your posts generally do contain some interesting views, and you're a pretty good writer, but the underlining bitterness in your posts ends up making me, and I'm probably not alone, disregard many things that you're saying.
on Feb 04, 2005
"It's okay for you to bash someone who generalized "Christians" based upon what they read, see, etc... but then you turn right around and assume that YOU know the "true feelings" of all Christians?"

Nope, but when I talk about the feelings of a group I should at least have some reason to believe they feel that way. I don't know any Christian that believes Spongebob is gay, nor do I know any Christian that is "offended by the sexual content" of his show. Focus on the Family never made any statement to that effect, either. So... who is assuming here?

Am I to blame when the author falsely accuses Christianity of "quibbling over the sexual preferences of a cartoon character"? So if someone accused you of condemning Spongebob's sexuality, you'd overlook it and deal with his overall point? No, like I said, if he had addressed the real issue, this wouldn't have happened. Spongebob's sexuality, or his show, has never been the issue.

"EchoDecember said that this is his first blogging experience, but he's already observant enough to see what has become apparent to me whenever I read your comments. You never appear interested in hearing what anyone else says, but mostly only interested in tearing them down and trying to be the winner of the argument."

I'm interested in what he says, I simply find that he is basing his generalization on falsehood. How can you compare two sets of priorities when one is false?

Psychoanalyze me all you like, but your point is sadly diversionary. The fact remains that the basic theme of this article is misleading, and makes accusations that are patently false. I take exception to that.

on Feb 10, 2005
I'm interested in what he says, I simply find that he is basing his generalization on falsehood. How can you compare two sets of priorities when one is false?


Actually, I'm basing my generalization on past experience, which is another name for prejudice. And there lies the problem. This is my first real blog and I've found it to be a very enlightening experience. I guess the first step to learning is being able to know when you are wrong. Repentance, by any other name. And I repent of my words. I take back what I said about Christians and the whole Sponge Bob sexuality thing. Let us move onto more "true feelings of Christians" shall we?
I have had very negative experiences with Christians in the past. I didn't realize the extent of my hatred until this blog actually. But there is a burning bitterness inside me for wrongs committed in the past. I should thank you for that Baker, your critique forced me to confront my own prejudices and allow healing to begin. The funny thing about unforgiveness is that you often become the one you hate. I'm a bit embarrassed to find myself exhibitting the same stubborness and refusal to listen that I so broadly criticize fundamentalists for. As Neitszche warns, "Be careful in fighting the dragon, lest you become the dragon." I should have listened. You have accused me of being a liar and have been proven right. You say that I have made accusations that are patently false and I find that I have no words to respond with. You have won and I have lost, one more enemy of the Church has been silenced and beaten back with his tail between his legs. But are you sure you want this? Isn't the whole genius of Christian theology its ability to turn bitter enemies into friends?
When I met Jesus, I was bitter and angry at the entire Church and the entire Christian religion. My arguments may be false but you cannot deny me my experiences or my feelings. The funny thing about feelings and facts, is that two don't play very nicely as you've so articulately pointed out in your critique of my article. How does the saying go? We have a right to our own opinions, but not to our own facts. I will choose better examples next time.

Had you taken exception with true feelings of Christians, you wouldn't have heard a peep out of me, or maybe we'd have had a decent conversation. Instead you just made a lot of untrue assumptions and then based your rant on them. The fact that even now, after you know it is wrong, you are leaving heaps of falsehoods in your article troubles me, and makes me wonder if you are sincere in your care about Christianity.


So help me rewrite this article then. This is how true dialogue commences no? What are the true feelings of Christians? You know much more about this Sponge Bob case than I do, what is really at stake here? Certainly not the sexuality of a cartoon character, we can both agree upon that. During my meditation upon this blog and your response, something has awakened in me that has been long dormant. I used to care about the truth. I used to consider wisdom more precious than silver. But as I've grown older, cynicism has made me dumb and foolish. "The truth shall set you free." It was a noble dream and a foolish one, but perhaps it can still live and quell this enmity growing between us?
on Feb 11, 2005
There's no enmity here. This is kind of a pet peeve, because I have been hearing this over and over in the media, with no regard to the actual issue. Each time it is passed from hand to hand, it becomes more cemented in people's minds, until we find ourselves where we are, with everyone thinking that Christians think Spongebob is gay.

We have Jerry Falwell's Tinky Winky junk to thank for this one. Because he said that, then this was an easy conclusion to jump to. People hear "Christians" and "Cartoon Characters", and Mr. Falwell's previous silliness fills in the blank.

I mentioned my blog about it above, and the sites of the Christian organizations and the "We Are Family Foundation" are readily accessable. There's tons of editorial floating around as well. I don't think you really need dialogue, you just needed to look beyond the pre-digested junk that comes out of the media.

You'll find that the right/wrong of homosexuality never enters into this. What is at issue is the concept of "Tolerance" as opposed to "Acceptance". You don't have to teach about sexuality, or even mention it, to teach tolerance. My issue is with the idea that we have to agree with people, or at least take an "I'm Okay, You're Okay" stance, in order to be tolerant of them.

If neo-nazis move in next door to me, I don't have to take an "I'm okay, you're okay" attitude in order not to abuse them. I can live tolerantly, avoid conflict, and still vehemently disagree with their acts and who they are as people. That isn't the brand of tolerance you find at tolerance.org. They take the differences in opinions, and make the side they disagree with "myths". The act of disagreeing is deemed intolerant.

No one will know how heavy-handed the "We Are Family Foundation" will be until the materials are shipped to 61,000 public schools in March. Given their affiliations, many feel that this merits parental review. No Christians should be allowed to be there to teach their opinions of homosexuality. In that light, though, opposition to Christian beliefs shouldn't be taught either.

People enevitibly bring up Evolution when I say that, but you can teach fact without teaching "truth". We can learn the facts of evolution, its history, its theory, its proofs, without ever having a values judgement made. In the case of homosexual tolerance, the current trend is to "dispell myths", and most of those myths are religious belief.

For that reason, many differ with "tolerance" programs, and the hijacking of unrelated characters makes it even more insidious to them. I have a blog called Imposed Acceptance is Intolerance that outlines my feelings on this.

I try not to make moral judgements either way. A level playing field is what matters to me. When activist organizations have access to public school while those whose beliefs they discount as "myth" are barred, it isn't level. Public school isn't a place to combat religion, any more than a place to promote it. There's no reason either opinion need be present to teach tolerance.

Kids shouldn't be intolerant to anyone, regardless of their beliefs about them. The beliefs should never enter into it.
on Feb 11, 2005
P.S. I appreciate your recent post, but do you think you should leave the blog as it is? Not everyone is going to read hundreds of lines of comments. Given that, most people will deal with your blog as you dealt with CNN and believe:

"An evangelical Christian group called Focus on the Family was offended by the sexual content found within the kids show Sponge Bob Square pants."


While you decide what your take on the real situation is, it might be wise to at least remove the material you know yourself to be false.